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Battery health

asked 2014-06-16 11:35:53 +0300

LVPVS gravatar image

updated 2015-03-05 17:03:42 +0300

Hej,

I just noticed that the health of my battery (according to CSD Tool) is below 89%. Two weeks ago it was between 92-93%.

I got my Jolla (as one of "The First One"s) just before Christmas 2013. I am using it ever since as my daily phone.

Do you think it is a normal deterioration of the battery?

Edit I

When I got my Jolla back from Finland, the health of my battery was ~92%.

Two weeks later it is ~81%.

I am not charging it over-night. I always try to avoid charging over 90%.

Still, my battery seems to be deteriorating rather rapidly...

End of Edit I

Edit II

As of 23.01.2015, my Jolla's battery seems to be revived.

A bout a few months ago (when the health was around 71% an I missed the opportunity to buy a spare battery from Jolla) I picked up a new habit to charge it:

Before falling a sleep I charge my Jolla until 80-85% of SoC while reading news and interacting social media. I totally forgot about the CSD Tool. Then today I checked it and to my greatest surprise, my battery was back at 86.97%!

End of Edit II

Edit III

I helped myself out with this script: https://together.jolla.com/question/55764/charging-limitation-for-enhanced-battery-life-feature-request/?answer=85249#post-id-85249

End of Edit III

LVPVS out.

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Where do you see the percentage? I see only a "Good" for the health. The capacity is shown as percentage.

Jörg ( 2014-06-16 11:54:58 +0300 )edit
3

as mentioned you get this informations from CSD Tool. You get access when you type *#*#310#*#*in the phone app ->accept->individual test->battery, there you can see the capscity in my case 94,7%

drummer12 ( 2014-06-16 12:13:00 +0300 )edit

Health is "good" on my device, but capacity 88.32%. I got it back in Helsinki and use it as main phone since.

Blizzz ( 2014-06-16 12:18:40 +0300 )edit

Mine says "Good" as well. But I don't like the percentage... O.o

LVPVS ( 2014-06-16 14:38:26 +0300 )edit

mine is 89.9 (2hand buy -first one) it's says good , maybe we can see in the future an app with advise, when to charge ... or an app to full discharge ... so we can also see what app is using the most of battery at the moment i use lighhouse it gives all a lots of informations ... For me device gives too much alarm when battery drops and it uses power to give alarm ....

mvdm ( 2014-06-16 16:03:02 +0300 )edit

5 Answers

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4

answered 2014-06-16 14:56:53 +0300

Jörg gravatar image

updated 2014-06-16 15:35:04 +0300

Here are some detailed information regarding capacity and prolonging the life of Li-Ion batteries: How to Prolong Lithium-based Batteries Some key sentences of the article:

"Although a battery should deliver 100 percent capacity during the first year of service, it is common to see lower than specified capacities, and shelf life may have contributed to this loss. ... If at all possible, avoid full discharges and charge the battery more often between uses. ... Partial discharge on Li-ion is fine; there is no memory and the battery does not need periodic full discharge cycles to prolong life ... Lithium-ion suffers from stress when exposed to heat, so does keeping a cell at a high charge voltage ... and the worst situation is keeping a fully charged battery at elevated temperatures."

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I read a newer article, there they said, that perhaps there could also be something like the memory effect with Li-Ion batteries and therefore you should charge your phone at different battery states e.g sometimes at 70% or 40% and so on.

If you're leaving your phone charging the whole night the battery management stops charging at 100% but at some point maybe 98 or 97% it starts charging again without needing, so the battery capacity sinks with every charging cycle a bit and in result you can get the result of LVPVS I think, but obviously it's only my opinion ;-)

drummer12 ( 2014-06-16 15:14:37 +0300 )edit
3

@drummer12: You are right, but only if lithium iron phosphate is used (which is mostly used in electric cars) and the effect is minimal . In mobile phones other materials are used which do not show memory effects, according to this article (unfortunately in german): Memory-Effekt bei Lithium-Ionen-Akkus. However, I also found the hint to disconnect the device, if fully charged in order to prolong life (also in German): Zehn Fakten, die Sie über Lithium-Ionen-Akkus wissen sollten

Jörg ( 2014-06-16 15:26:47 +0300 )edit

Thanks for clarifying this, thought it is also the case on "normal Li-Ion battery". Thanks for the articles, true luck that I'm able to read german ;-)

drummer12 ( 2014-06-16 15:36:39 +0300 )edit
3

answered 2014-06-16 12:24:47 +0300

updated 2014-06-16 12:26:09 +0300

It's quite hard to say if it's normal or not because there are many circumstances complaining on that. If you only charged your phone one time in that period I would say it's not normal. But if you're charging your Phone every day maybe a few times then I would say it is normal.

I read a report about Li-Ion batteries, there were differents hints to keep bettery health high:

  • Charging the battery at different power levels (20%, 40%)
  • Sometimes discharge the battery complet or nearly complete and then charge again till 100%
  • Don't let the Phone charge the whole night, better charge it before going to bed and unplug during the night.
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Thank you, drummer12. I think I failed with your last point. I will need to revise my habit of charging the phone. LVPVS

LVPVS ( 2014-06-16 14:37:27 +0300 )edit

me too i let it sometimes charge all the night , what is wrong with that ?

mvdm ( 2014-06-16 16:04:51 +0300 )edit
2

The hints you are reporting should be for NiCd or NiMH batteries. As far as I know, Li-ion batteries simply need to be charged whenever you can. Taking them to low charge levels shortens their life (or better, keeping them in high charge levels extends their life). You can safely keep them plugged in the whole night since the phone will stop charging the battery as soon as it's full.

Giacomo Di Giacomo ( 2014-06-16 16:12:30 +0300 )edit
1

Link: Memory Effect detected - Li-Ion Battery In case of Li-Ion with Iron and Phosphore. Also the life time of an usual Li-Ion-battery is expressed in charging cycles, so scientist say a usual battery will "live" around 500-800 Charging cycles. If you always charge the batterys' capacity is getting lower. Or why do you think, that after 2 years normally you have to change your battery because you need to charge it more often?

drummer12 ( 2014-06-16 17:31:36 +0300 )edit
2

The capacity is expressed in full charging cycles, that is, 500 full charges or 2000 1/4 capacity charges. The number of such full charging cycles increases if you prevent the battery from going too low in charge (or, seeing it another way, every time you let your battery discharge too much you eat up a small bit of its capacity).

Giacomo Di Giacomo ( 2014-06-16 17:50:16 +0300 )edit
3

answered 2015-01-23 16:26:07 +0300

lakutalo gravatar image

updated 2016-05-20 11:55:41 +0300

All above said, this inspires me to suggest some kind of battery health app/service. It should track the user's charging habits combining battery health status and eventually lead to recommendations visible in the notification area.

EDIT: From empirical tests I have observed that battery health gets better when using the original charger instead of connecting the phone with a USB cable to the PC. After using the PC as charger, health dropped considerably fast from 93% to 89% in a couple of weeks. Now it is back at almost 93% again.

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answered 2015-01-24 18:35:14 +0300

simo gravatar image

Battery capacities have been reported in this related question: https://together.jolla.com/question/53741/battery-capacity/

Quoting here also a great comment by Giacomo Di Giacomo:

The capacity is expressed in full charging cycles, that is, 500 full charges or 2000 1/4 capacity charges. The number of such full charging cycles increases if you prevent the battery from going too low in charge (or, seeing it another way, every time you let your battery discharge too much you eat up a small bit of its capacity).

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Now this is really interesting. My rule of thumb has always been not to recharge if not nearly empty and not to fully discharge. Even though Li-ion batteries are said not to be sensitive to the so called "memory effect", I have always tried to act on this rule and so far my batteries are still healthy.

Your post puts a number to my vague description of nearly empty. Thank you! :-)

lakutalo ( 2015-01-24 19:42:31 +0300 )edit
1

answered 2014-06-24 12:18:06 +0300

updated 2014-06-24 13:14:08 +0300

I noticed a quite interesting behaviour. The Capacity is toggling, now I have above 97% sometimes it's much lower... anyone similar experience?

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Strange as it may sound, but I recently checked the health of my battery with CSD tool and it showed 93%... Probably it depends on a lot of conditions, like temperatures, SoC and such...

LVPVS ( 2014-06-24 13:19:34 +0300 )edit

Yes, the capacity vary: My battery-capacity has raised up from 69.28% to 73.96%. Is there more? ;)

Maddis ( 2014-06-24 16:21:55 +0300 )edit

Can someone -officially- confirm tips for prolongation of battery life? Please! I was told today about the no-charging-the-entire-night thing... Never thought it mattered.

dmelamet ( 2014-07-10 04:56:06 +0300 )edit

Hej, I was also charging my phone(s, not only Jolla, but all) the whole night. After getting some suggestions here, I took a deep breath and changed my habit. I bought a timer switch, set a time frame of one and a half hours on it. I keep my charger connected to it. I still connect my Jolla to the charger when getting to bed, but this time the phone is only being charged during that set time frame. This change in my charging habit resulted in 4-5% improvement in my battery's condition. Formerly below 89% to now over 93%.

LVPVS ( 2014-07-10 12:10:07 +0300 )edit

I tested my phone battery with CSD tool and the capacity just keeps dropping, 0.3 per cent in last week (now it is at 88,61 per cent). Additonally, I tested the "Battery resistance" with the same tool and it reported FAIL. Is the battery going bad or do others get the same results with the tool? I have to warn that you probably have to reboot the phone after testing the resistance. My phone does not find the mobile network after testing. Testing also takes a while as it collects 31 samples.

jtl ( 2014-09-22 18:07:48 +0300 )edit
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Asked: 2014-06-16 11:35:53 +0300

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Last updated: May 20 '16