Is f2fs available in 3.4 and up?

For me not licensing exFAT is also pivotal. I'd much rather have a user friendly UI for formatting the card as one of the above mention "open" formats. Maybe show a dialog if the user inserts a card with a not supported format offering the choice to format the card.

If exFAT support is purely sofware based, it could also offer to purchase support for it.

No, f2fs was introduced in kernel version 3.8. Probably would be wise to have a more recent version, this is a new file system and received a lot of bug fixes lately.

Are we stuck with kernel version 3.4 for any reason? That would be really sad.

I'd propose that you remove the statement about your dislikes about exfat and license fee. I agree about that, but I think we are voting here about possible alternatives that we would like to see, not whether we like exfat or not. Our dislike we have already shown here, or?

but I think we are voting here about possible alternatives that we would like to see, not whether we like exfat or not.

I think exFAT problem is included here as well. So proposal to make it optional is one part of the vote here. That's the original issue after all.

Is that really what Jane does... Jane buys an sdcard puts it in her tablet and everything else is magic for her - she connects the tablet to her computer and starts copying files, no? Every Camera has that in the manual, "If your card is not usable in the camera you might need to use the 'Format SDCard' option from the menu!"

And since MTP is still defective on OSX, she needs to put the card directly into an sd slot on a mac. Which is able to understand exFAT.

• "fuse support" invalidates option 1. How many Jane Does know how to install the fuse driver, and mount it?
  • Regarding (2): So it works on 2/3 OSs. A rather poor metric. Especially considering an open source tablet would only be compatible with propietary OSs by default, kinda ironic.
  • Regarding (4): Using a propietary FS by default actually does contradict sponsoring open-sourceness.

Yes, 2/3 of all OSes, but +90% of all Desktop Computers, since Linux is still a minority. Jane Doe does not use Linux. If she did, Linux will probably tell her to format the sd card, this file system will probably be readable by the tablet anyway. I still do not see why supporting the theoretical use of a propriety FS does contradict your pure open-source usage of the device. This is not about Jolla forcing users to use anything, it is about their right to advertise something which might gain a larger market share.

For people with knowhow and interest in technology it may be acceptable to format the card on other file system, but not for average joe. I don't want to see threads about lost files because of uneducated user doing format unintentionally. So, I think it's better to swallow our pride and pay the license for the sake of user friendliness for average people interested in Jolla.

So what filesystem should be taken? I think that most if not all of us agree to taking LUKS for (optional) encryption of the microsd and maybe even part/all of the phone memory. You could even do exFAT on LUKS, although that won't be supported by many standard consumer devices... But what filesystem/combination would you propose? I thought this is a question to give us alternatives to exFAT, not only vote for encryption.

I'm against the option to have the device become a brick if the sd-card is removed. I've had micro SD cards fail on me before, and the last thing I would want is to also lose all the data on the device's internal storage if the micro SD card happens to fail.

My experience at least with Android tablets is that the microSD cards are less reliable than the internal storage. So I would prefer to have the personal data on the internal storage and not on the SD card.

I'd like to keep the possibility to insert my camera sd card to edit photos on the run, so if the device's datas are all in another card I wouldn't be able to stuffs like that.

Call it TransFlash, as it was called some years ago.

and with fuse you can also support exFAT

If the name microSD is useable, just call it 128GB microSD and be done with it!

I am researching the internet and find no reason why UDF should not be used, would be glad if anybody would explain it to me. It's an open standard, supported by all operating systems (or most), has no data size limitations, etc. I use mainly Windows and as a test have formatted a 32gb microsd card with UDF; works flawlessly; I have read similar reports about Linux as well. So why not put a requirement to use any microsd you want to use with the Jolla Tablet with the tablet first? There it can give two default choices: format with UDF (cross compatible and free) or format with EXFAT (payable package). Either way after that choice, the microsd will be compatible with the other devices/OSes. Can somebody perhaps test a >32gb microsd with UDF on different OSes as well (I don't have any >32gb)?

@dimitridv:

While UDF is indeed supported on more systems than exFAT is, there are still cases where UDF isn't available - such as cameras for example. But in general now it's probably the best interoperable option overall which supports large volumes and large files as well.

@shmerl: in cameras honestly I wouldn't use a 128 GB microsd card; in mine I use a standard SD of 32 GB (FS: fat32); most don't support the SDXC format anyway, big SD cards are faster, and 32 GB of space are more than enough for a holiday long of shooting. Anybody else can suggest any other downside? I will probably create an answer just for UDF...

I don't get this either. I've been using UDF on my usb drives for ages and it's easily the most interoperable format available, and the only non-royalty filesystem that will work on Windows out of the box. I think UDF is the filesystem to choose on a 'people powered tablet'.

Regarding this statement, "Don't include exFAT by default (so crowdfunding money won't be wasted on it).", in my opinion (and as a fellow crowd funder), it isn't money wasted. That's a different opinion to yours for sure, but that's the nature of a crowd, we don't all agree. :) Be careful with blanket terms like that, which don't necessarily speak for all. ;)

KISS will have to rule here. ext\n or btrfs + LUKS + possibly LVM (I leave that decision to someone else, can be done without aswell) sounds like the sound option to me. BTRFS is already in use for both root and home on the Jolla, so beta or not we've already accepted it.

mount|grep btrfs

/dev/mmcblk0p28 on / type btrfs (rw,noatime,ssd,noacl,space_cache,autodefrag) /dev/mmcblk0p28 on /home type btrfs (rw,relatime,ssd,noacl,space_cache,autodefrag)

@jwalck Oh no, btrfs HAS to go completely (root, home, EVERYWHERE!)

• Look here disks-full-and-causing-various-problems
• This us unacceptable behavior in a commercial and expensive product!!!

@Kollin: Well, I agree on the issue that was linked, but as far as i unterstood, this issue surfaces because of the relatively small size of the internal flash. I do guess that with the 32GB flash in the tablet it might not have these issues. Especially not if joined with a microsd card of 32GB or more.

@dac Besides Btrfs killed two SanDisc 64 GB SDXC cards formated by this method here is the thread!

@Kollin: Was that because of taking the whole card, like Manatus said? Or it was not recoverable?

Two keywords in this poll for me would be KISS, and usability. The above offers both. The more this is discussed, the more I am supportive of paying for SDXC (and supporting exFAT) as well as offering encryption.

Isn't KISS a replacement for NFC or short range data transfer in general?

@chemist I was referring to the KISS principle. Not adding complexity for complexities sake. Appologies for the ambiguity!

I guess besides kernel support open filesystems require various tools like for fsck and the like (which are also needed to actually enable formatting in them). So may be the poll is about which open filesystems support to include in Sailfish out of the box?

As such this poll isn't really solving anything about the main problem backers have with exFAT licensing.

@shmerl: Good point, of course the file system tools are needed too. :) Not sure though if it's really necessary to include support for all the file systems supported by the kernel seeing the rather long list in my /lib/modules/*/kernel/fs directory (minix anyone? :P). Have adjusted the answer, thanks!

Forgot isofs in the file system list, sometimes you may have to mount a CD image. Added.

@flint: Hmm, what exactly is unclear? This poll is about you, proposing ideas or better solutions to support one or more open source file systems, as written at the beginning here: "...poll where you can vote and above all contribute by proposing better Open Source File System(s) support on the Jolla Tablet." And getting your input and contributions to make this go forward and happen so it answers a real need is what we propose. Hope it clarifies...

Hope it clarifies...

What's unclear is whether you can reconsider exFAT being mandatory (and make it for example optional and purchased on demand) based on this very input you are asking for or you decided to use it as a mandatory addition if stretch goal is reached still. Adding more filesystems in general sounds like an unrelated issue which doesn't address the original request.