XA2: Looking for arguments for sticking with Sailfish OS

Yes, it's not a refugee program, but it seems Jolla is too weak to take a stand. Even Safari has DDG set as default. I have not seen one single user respecting software product supporting Google. I can blindly suppory SFOS but this search engine thing is beyond me.

If I were Jolla I would certainly allow Google but still set DDG as default. I could imagine they set this years ago to Google because everyone seemed to use google.com as their search engine of choice back then and have not looked into this issue since then. But I'm not affiliated with Jolla so so this is just a guess of course.

Thanks, @spag, for your reply. Interesting wording: "no refugee program". May be right, but what else could be the motivation to unlock and flash a phone? It's a highly technical procedure for the majority of people and none of my friends would do that just to have the experience of an OS which is the "latest in a long heritage of mobile operating systems (Maemo, MeeGo) going back more than a decade". But at least there are some rare people with privacy concerns and looking for alternatives. Sailfish could be one.

Thanks for sharing your experience with BLE. I will continue my research in that.

Calendar: I just like agenda views, do not need the numbers from 1 to 31 eating screen space. But your mileage may vary

Jolla is targeting corporate customers for a while now and we probably have to call ourselves lucky to get some scraps (Sailfish X) at all.

I forgot to mention: BLE probably won't work with Android apps.

Thanks, @ossi1967. I'm feeling this is the most honest answer.

Also, I like your honest answer but I need to add here something: I really dislike the graphical user interface of Android up to the latest version of it! SaifishOS is SO MUCH MORE FUN TO USE - regardless of it's pros and cons but this is my major reason... . There are over reasons as well... . With LineageOS (have it on my Xperia XZ Premium) I'm just like any other Android...user, it's useable but no fun. I wish I could change it on this phone (love the camera) but no custom version of SailfishOS available. Porting SailfishOS to it is a challenging approach, see XDA-devel-forum.

@Jonathan, I agree with Ossi1967 here that Sailfish is only a geek / hobbyist choice nowadays. LineageOS and CarbonROM are simply the most effortless options for a user seeking good "googleless" phones. iPhone should not be scoffed at either, as Apple's main business is not to sell your data or adds.

In addition to pure linux mainstream and educating myself point of views I use Sailfish only because I (still) like the user interface more than the Android's, even though Android has a very nice UX these days too.

While I do think that LineageOS does things overall better, and would endorse it to almost anybody over SFOS, I'd also like to point out that if you really want a googleless device, you cannot install much anything that uses Google framework on it. The framework is the most important and most capable tool of what Google has to follow messaging, location, habits etc. on people's devices. Unfortunately losing the framework cuts down the amount of usable apps drastically, as so many of them rely on its presence today. Usually when people go for LineageOS to avoid being spied upon, they are only fooling themselves unless they opt for MicroG (opensource option for Google apps). And having just MicroG on your device does not come without usability problems of its own until the project matures enough.

@ossi1967 - Sailfish OS does one thing better than all competitors. Multitasking.

@Jonathan, in addition to what @spag and @Manatus wrote, if a flavor of LineageOS suits you AND if you want MicroG built in from the start instead of installing Google services etc, this project by the /e/ foundation may be of interest. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki//e/_(operating_system) and https://e.foundation.

In addition to avoiding Google services they aim to build replacement versions of the stock Google apps and provide email and cloud services of their own instead of the Google ones.

Its early days and clearly very ambitious, but they seem to have nightly builds, but no official maintainer, for the Xperia XA2.

Not sure what to make of it myself, but it might be another option.

I missed a bunch of things because sailfish's calendar app doesn't have event notification... I don't think it's ugly but it's certainly missing most features. You can get used to not having a calendar app, but you're phone is just a lot less smart that way.

I honestly can't say anything about it, because I hardly ever use calendar apps. I'm sure it's not as feature-packed as Android calendars, but again - "...missing most features" means, "it's not like my Android", (since Google invented these certain features, that means all others that don't have them are missing features, [so everything will naturally become Android by the time it's perfected])...

@Levone1: If you can't say anything about it, how can you say all these certain features come from Android calendar? What about Nokia phones, Blackberries, IPhones etc. Don't make it a Sailfish vs. Android thing. I never owned an Android phone but I think I can still guess some of the features the OP is missing, although I don't like how he expressed it here, too.

@Se-zuo: No notifications? When you create or edit an event you can set when you want to be reminded. Has been there forever.

@Pohli - sorry, that was presumptuous of me - it's true that I don't really know anything about calendar apps, and very little about most of those platforms. I should have just left it at that.

Thanks, @nepomuk, for your reply. I would add FairphoneOS and PureOS to your list of systems I would like to try. Maybe one day ...

i wondering evry time, why the hell peoplecome from Android/IOS to SailfishOS and want the same quaility of OS like Android/IOS.

SailfishOSis great because we get possibility. we get possibility to change and setup things like we want. SF will never be the same quality like IOS/Android. There never will be the same amount of apps, the apps will never work the same way like on Android.

Who need Whatsapp and all the shiny-shitt-apps will get better way working on the android / ios.

Thats all. SailfishOS is and will be a niche- nerd-os... dont mix it with Whatsapp. nothing good will come out :)

Yeah!!! Well said.

@ExPLIT Well, we pretty much agree that Sailfish is not for the mainstream at this moment and won't be in short or mid-term.

As for expectations people that buy a product generally expect it to work as advertized, with reasonable amount of bugs. So someone reads up on jolla.com that there is a smartphone and it has Android compatibility layer, all nice and rainbows. Nowhere it's stated that it's extremely buggy (like 2/5 stars buggy), or that it's for hackers, nerds, linux devs and other tinkerers. And you shouldn't buy this phone unless you really know what you are doing. Inevitably they find out how things really are and are disappointed. So we see posts like this one all around...

Fully agree with this! BTW, there are also other ways of communication i.e. Telegram which is in SailfishOS almost great/still far away from perfect but worth donating with the app called: 'Depecher'.

@butler, I'm no dev or particularly tinkering-happy power user, but I have had Sailfish as my daily driver since 2015 with a Jolla Phone and Intex Aqua Fish. Other than certain non-essential Android apps refusing to work because of "jailbroken" OS, I got no complaints on the everyday use, and with all the extra things that Sailfish OS allows me to do in comparison to the consumer mobile OSes it has come to be a no-brainer to hang along.

I now got a XA2 with beta, and I'm in a new situation as an early adopter for the first time in my Sailfish life. Bugs like the proximity sensor acting up on phone calls, Android app non-access to SD card, and the Google Play -needing apps are currently keeping me from adopting XA2 as my main phone YET, but I'm certain it's again a question of 'when' and not 'if' when my XA2 has had the more serious kinks ironed out enough for me to do just that.

The lack of maturation obviously is something I accepted eyes open when opting for a 'beta', so this is not a complaint, but only a notion that the sweet spot of usage of a XA2 with Sailfish OS is only coming up in the future. I wouldn't have hurried if I didn't have doubts on the availability of the XA2 device on that latter day.

Jolla employs around 50+ people vs Android development 10k+ people

"But that company isn’t big neither or?"

I am aware of the size of Jolla and their poor recources. My disappointment comes more from the way the 50+ are treating their community. :-*

I get that it's great to have all kinds of security and privacy options. What I don't get is why you'd want it in the first place. It's like hardening the inside of your house because you want to leave your front door open. DON'T. INSTALL. SHITTY. APPS. Solves a lot of those problems.

@Fuzzillogic Ey, what‘s wrong with you? Why you CAPS LOCK me?! I see some of those „shitty“ apps as useful and an enrichment for my life. WhatsApp is unfortunately too popular. To be able to communicate with some of my friends and co-worker, it‘s needed. Photo editor apps are worth it to „open my front door“ for them. Same for games. I love them and I want to play in the bus and train, but most of the good stuff wants your data and most of the FOSS games are...well...let‘s say, I never saw Tux as a heroic game character. ;)

Thanks, @Glitchard, for your reply. "Booking as donation" could become my way, too. But i will give SFOS one more chance in the next days.

I know the pain since my Xperia was affected by the roaming issue as well but luckily a reflash fixed it in my case. Nevertheless we should be fair here: The roaming issue happens with some phones/installations for unclear reasons. Same counts for the cellular stability. It is a small but loud minority (which is natural for community/support boards).

@mcencora: sad but true @Spark, it may be a small but loud minority (is it?), I was also plagued by mobile data connectivity problems on my X and I didn't need roam anywhere, the connection just died on itself while phone was lying on a table - without any error message. Sometimes did vanish the mobile connection totally. Couldnt ring or be ringed. This is not something that an OS provider can overlook as a "minor problem'... That needs to be priority nr 1. Nothing works if mobile data doesnt work

Thanks, @pawel, for your reply. Are there any written promises from Jolla Ltd about how long the XA2 is supported?

I have seen none, but jolla 1 is 5 years and still supported. Jolla tablet: never finished, but you do get updates, intex is now 2-3 years old: not sure if intex supplies updates but you can do.it from cmd.line.. I.have jolla 1, intex and xperia x in my household...

So, the past shows sfos is not the.issue. The hw bugs is what you have to get use.to live.with. And xperia x is realy fine, beside camera and fingerprint .

I m here because google.ads sucks and i pay with less comfort..

I would.wait till they remove the beta from name :-) You can still sell the device here then ..

People have different reasons. See some at https://together.jolla.com/question/177777/question-sailfish-os-vs-aosp-rom/