[Poll] File System(s) support on SD card for Jolla Tablet

asked 2014-12-03 15:16:30 +0300

This post is a wiki. Anyone with karma >75 is welcome to improve it.

updated 2014-12-05 22:17:31 +0300

pulsar
755 ●32 ●53 ●59

Dear Jolla Community,

As announced in this post, here is an official poll where you can vote and above all contribute by proposing better Open Source File System(s) support on the Jolla Tablet.

As an example, an encrypted microSD card (LUKS) is a possible option.

We really want to drive this with your immensely valuable input, and work together to implement the solutions you want and need.

So please, have your say, discuss and vote on what really matters to you, the Community!

Thank you <3

Jolla Tablet Team

As this is a poll, remember to always set your answer as a wiki post, else you might lose some karma points...
And also have a look to the guidelines tag to learn more about our general practices, thanks!

@Stskeeps wrote:

As a general note: here's the chance to affect something better being supported for open file systems under SailfishOS. Exclude X from device isn't something doing that. Things like, export your files as ext3 over USB, multi-partition support in the device, enablement of swap if existing in file system table, selections in dialogs of ext4/btrfs/ZFS/what do you have, .. even NFS. It's a good time to get creative.

Once we have gathered a good amount of feedback and ideas, we will take the most significant (feasibility, usefulness...) proposals and gather them in a new poll as runner ups for the final decision on what can be implemented.
Let's work this together :)

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20

Why is everything "jolla-tablet"? I thought it is SailfishOS... the then two devices should behave the same, software-wise.

chemist ( 2014-12-03 17:54:21 +0300 )edit

10

The answer: inidiviual pay for exfat. People who wants to use it, can use it. You can push it to Sailfish just as the optional update(1.1.x) before. Pay Jolla, Jolla flips the switch and a system-update comes in, with exfat.

RobNas ( 2014-12-03 18:14:58 +0300 )edit

6

As a general note: here's the chance to affect something better being supported for open file systems under SailfishOS. Exclude X from device isn't something doing that. Things like, export your files as ext3 over USB, multi-partition support in the device, enablement of swap if existing in file system table, selections in dialogs of ext4/btrfs/ZFS/what do you have, .. even NFS. It's a good time to get creative.

Stskeeps ( 2014-12-03 21:48:49 +0300 )edit

3

Reading Stskeeps's comment it may be better to retitle the poll and not restrict it to file system support "on SD card" as the tablet has USB host mode and file system support is also essential for devices which are attached to the USB port or connected over the network.

flint ( 2014-12-04 18:12:35 +0300 )edit

3

This topic is very related to the wiki post I made nearly a year ago, so be sure to pay a visit to it :) : https://together.jolla.com/question/9816/use-alternative-file-systems-for-sd-card/

javispedro ( 2014-12-04 19:30:05 +0300 )edit

2

answered 2014-12-04 18:20:24 +0300

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updated 2014-12-04 20:04:33 +0300

flint
51 ●1 ●3 ●8

Although it's not a direct request for file system support:

Please add an sshd package for the tablet so that you can use sshfs to access the tablet file systems from remote. The sshd should not be enabled by default but easy to enable (and disable) from a widget or menu entry (like on the N900).

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2

Sounds like you don't have a Jolla, sshd is part of developer mode, I'd expect nothing less for the tablet.

chemist ( 2014-12-04 18:41:03 +0300 )edit

@chemist: Right, I've ordered the phone only after the tablets and don't have it yet. Good to see something I like to have is already implemented in SailfishOS after seeing that many things which I had expected to be there are not implemented (as I thought SailfishOS is an advancement from MeeGo which is an advancement from Maemo). So far it looks like my old N900 still has to keep up for a while ... :(

flint ( 2014-12-04 19:55:08 +0300 )edit

2

answered 2014-12-06 18:25:44 +0300

shyam
21 ●4

F2FS is a good option

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2

answered 2015-01-31 15:56:53 +0300

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updated 2015-01-31 15:56:53 +0300

cemoi71

14264 ●310 ●434 ●439

did someone give a look on it?:
exfat google code
Samsung Properly Open-Sources exFAT File-System

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2

answered 2015-01-31 23:10:39 +0300

pisco
363 ●6 ●11 ●14

From the Ubuntu universe repository I installed exfat-fuse and exfat-utils. Both packages were free, so I guess there is no license burden.

With these installed I can read, write and format exFAT. Please use them whithin sailfishOS and dump any logo, that only would spoil the looks of this beautiful tablet.

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1

answered 2014-12-05 20:11:46 +0300

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updated 2014-12-05 20:12:54 +0300

Fuzzillogic

4825 ●66 ●95 ●88

Since the stretch goal is reached, I guess the option not to include exFAT support is gone 😞. How about this: do include exFAT-support, as per stretch goal, but instead give away Harbor credit, free app or even discount on the device for people who actively uninstall and remove the exFAT-support, i.e. who give up their license to use it.

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1

You need the license to advertise it, not to use it. There are free libs and tools. The stretch goal was about the ability to advertise the compatibility to sdxc.

the_mgt ( 2015-02-01 11:30:05 +0300 )edit

If that's the case, then why not include these libraries? Then larger than SDHC cards, while not specifically supported, would still automatically work. But I'm afraid it's not just the trademark which require these licenses, but the patents on exFAT as well. That might not be relevant in Europe, but there are some less enlightened regions in the world, regarding software patents and interoperability.

Fuzzillogic ( 2015-02-01 17:28:04 +0300 )edit

1

You can silently include support for every single fancy thing on earth and maybe even remote access to Hubble space telescope. A completely different matter is being able to loudly and legally advertise a feature.

You'r average linux distro can play DVDs and probably do some other stuff for which it has no legal backing to advertise it. That is why some distros do not even ship with those features, instead you will need to add a repository or do some other trick.

the_mgt ( 2015-02-04 02:30:40 +0300 )edit

1

answered 2015-01-30 19:31:12 +0300

K and J
131 ●1 ●8 ●10

Please be aware of the fact that sailors have to reckon with the wind. You cannot sail straight on. Personally I think it would be good to let Linux grow, but forcing things and keep things apart is not so wise.

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0

answered 2014-12-04 14:00:08 +0300

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updated 2014-12-04 14:14:57 +0300

samivi
1 ●3

When i open my Jolla i want it to work like normal tablet (with memory-card support). It will need to support fully my normal memory-cards when i move them to Jolla's Tablet from my camera, other tablets, or my phone.

If there is some sort "format tool" that destroys my data before mounting it, then the whole memory-cards slot is useless.

This whole thing is absurd. When we funded Jolla in Indiegogo there was no indicator that tablet may not be a fully functional when ready. Then Jolla added those coals, that some basic functionality (Memory-card support) is added only if more people join and back Jolla. And even that was not enough for Jolla, now customers have to fight and vote to have the functionality that's normal in good devices.

But if we normal people lose this battle and linux fanatics from maemo.org win and tablet would be crippled, i hope Jolla gives our money back and some apology.

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this is about what open FS should be supported not that you want (ex)fat to work on your tablet... and an uSD slot that formats your card if it does not know the FS sounds like windows asking yes/no to format it when I plug it in...

chemist ( 2014-12-04 14:04:56 +0300 )edit

@chemist: You might have misunderstood him. From what I understood, he wants his Jolla Tablet to work like any normal tablet. He wants to put an exFAT formatted card into the tablet without losing data and without an "memory card unreadable, please reforma" dialogue. Sounds to as if he was against the windows behavior you refer to.

the_mgt ( 2014-12-04 14:27:49 +0300 )edit

but this question is not about exFAT "contribute by proposing better Open Source File System(s) support on the Jolla Tablet" and in $20k he will get his exfat

chemist ( 2014-12-04 14:55:13 +0300 )edit

yes, but if you follow the link from the "support larger SD cards" question and only read the heading, you might get the impression that this is at least partly about exfat. Still, I do not get the direction of the question. I wrote another answer with some ideas.

the_mgt ( 2014-12-04 15:11:47 +0300 )edit

0

answered 2015-01-08 16:39:35 +0300

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updated 2015-01-08 16:39:35 +0300

Tuxle
316 ●5 ●7 ●9

Btrfs seems a good option.

Maybe optionally let the user Flag the SD-Card so Jolla creates an FAT-32 Partition at the End of the Card. This way users could take some space with them if they wanted to migrate to another Phone/Tablet

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0

answered 2015-01-30 19:22:57 +0300

K and J
131 ●1 ●8 ●10

We don't help Jolla forward by refusing this. I accepted the offer of 64 GB and when I notice a lack of compatibility, with my Mac, I will install Linux on my computer.

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answered 2015-02-07 13:18:14 +0300

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updated 2015-02-07 22:22:44 +0300

cemoi71

14264 ●310 ●434 ●439

As we could understand, is whatever could be the format technology, the know-how how to program or use it, is not so difficult to get.
The only problem is on business side and justice, how is it acceptable to handle.
Some of users don't want to support, financial or because of ideology,ethic.
Others don't want to evolve in a niche way. Sd-cards are all delivered with exfat, and get it work with something else as format, would be not so easy to use with other devices.

Maybe the idea could be, that the os has for example a "tiny partition manager" which directly recognize and handle a few number of free format. But recognize only (without to have possibility to handle) other kinds as soon as the mounting interface detect a new card in slot. This manager would then inform the user of it with a pop-up windows (for example): "Ahoy sailor! you navigate in foreigner water with exfat(for example) format! you need an extra package for using it! if you accept this, the device will be connected on the web to get it..." "heyho Matrose! du navigierst in fremde Gewässer als exfat Format! Ein extra packet ist dafür gebraucht! Mit ja betätigen, wird ein Verbindung gebaut, und den Packet geholt zum installieren" "Salut poilu! Tu navigues sur des eaux étrangères au format exfat! Afin de le support un paquet externe doit être installe! Confirmer ici, et une communication va être établie a cette fin!

User will be then oriented to a jolla native app, which contains the links to each kind of well known format rpm-packages. It present itself as a list of format, and with buttons could the user load/install/uninstall what he want.
Then each format will be bound to mount manager and partition manager.
In this way that clear that sailfish os contain no format with royalties like exfat. and user could use it for him for free. no patent and royalties problem.

@pulsar and @eric What do you think about? Activity here is little bit reduced here. do you have enough material?

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[Poll] File System(s) support on SD card for Jolla Tablet

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